Taxpayer Advocacy Panel (TAP)
Joint Committee Face to Face Minutes
June 25 - 27, 2007
Denver, Colorado
Day 3 - Wednesday, June 27, 2007

Day 3 - Wednesday, June 27, 2007

Designated Federal Official
Bernie Coston, TAP Director

Members Present
J. T. Wright, TAP Chair
Robert Meyers, TAP Vice-chair
Bill Bly, Chair, Burden Reduction
Paul Duquette, Chair, VITA
Tom Karwin, Chair, Communication
Merijane (M J) Lee, Chair, Ad Hoc
Howard Margulies, Area 1
Maryann Motza, Chair, Area 6
Ferd Schneider, Chair, Area 4
Max Scott, Chair, Notices Committee
Lynwood Sinnamon, Chair, Area 2
Wayne Whitehead, Chair, Area 7
Jerry Fireman, Chair, TAC Committee

Members Absent
Dorothy Havey, Chair, Area 1
Hank Mosler, Chair, Area 3
Stanley Wernz, Chair, EITC
Ken Wright, Chair, Area 5

Staff Present
Barbara Foley, Program Analyst
Patti Robb, Note Taker
Kayla Walker, Acting TAP Manager
Nancy Ferree, TAP Manager
Judi Nicholas, TAP Manager

The meeting is scheduled for August 16, 2007, 10 to 11:30 a.m.  J.T. Wright wants suggestions for agenda topics.  The only firm attendees will be Coston, J.T. Wright, Bob Meyers, and Maryann Motza.  Two other members of the Joint Committee will also attend.
ACTION:  Joint Committee members who would like to attend the Commissioner Meeting should send an email to Coston, J.T. Wright, and Meyers.

The objective is to P deliver all of TAP’s important points to the Commissioner.  Motza and Margulies are on the subcommittee putting together the materials and recommendations for the Commissioner and need to get firm direction from the Joint Committee on what is needed.  The Committee is hoping to wrap this up by the first of August since a detailed agenda needs to be sent to the Commissioner’s office at least a week before the meeting.  As materials are developed, they will be sent to the Joint Committee members for approval.

Bly asked what positive outcome came from last year’s meeting.  Coston said some extra money was earmarked for VITA and that made the program owners in Atlanta take notice.  The media attention paid to the issue statements was also very helpful to TAP.

Karwin said we should acknowledge TAP is working in conjunction with the Taxpayer Advocate Service to give the taxpayers’ perspective to TAB.  Schneider suggested asking the Commissioner’s staff if he has any issues he would be interested in that TAP can offer the benefits of their experience.  Nicholas thought the Commissioner may not be aware of the TAC survey the TAC committee has done; the final report should be available in the fall.  Motza said Estelle Tunley, Director, Field Assistance, Customer Assistance Relationship and Education (CARE), has been incredibly responsive and suggested leading off with this issue.

Meyers’ concern with Schneider’s suggestions is that TAP also needs to make it clear that TAP has an agenda of issues to speak about.  The Commissioner meets with so many people over a length of time and TAP needs to be cognizant that he has already heard from others about some of the issues TAP is bringing.  What TAP doesn’t want to do is to only respond to the Commissioner’s hot topics, but to also say TAP brings the pulse of the public and here is what they are saying.  The attendees should also be prepared to say we don’t have all the details but we can get them for you.  TAP will continue to bring the grassroots view. 

Motza reported the thirteen categories of discussion were brought to the subcommittee’s attention.  A few of them are:

• Tax gap issues
• Follow-up on issues elevated last year to Commissioner Everson (position papers are available on TAPSpace and improveirs.org).
• VITA topics
• Show that town hall meetings do have the pulse of public
• Offer-In-Compromise (OIC) issues
• IRS preparation of the Form 1040EZ

Karwin expressed that he is uncomfortable talking about the tax gap issue.  Motza replied that much of the information gathered from town halls and outreaches concerned the tax gap.  Margulies suggested giving examples of issues elevated from the town hall meetings and other outreaches.  The Form 8300, Report of Cash Payments Over $10,000 Received in a Trade or Business, issue is a good one to present as a success.  Bly said the Burden Reduction Committee just met and dealt with a lot of tax gap issues.  It was geared to small businesses.  Bly also suggested not taking too many issues to the Commissioner.  The important part of this to bring up the fairness issue as well as emphasizing TAP brings the taxpayer’s viewpoint and TAP is here to help the IRS improve customer service. 

Motza is hoping to lead off the meeting with the commissioner with a report on the TAC visits.  Meyers emphasized that TAP’s main task is to help the taxpayer, not the IRS.  TAP shows the IRS ways to help taxpayers, not only to reduce taxpayer burden, but also help the IRS save money. 
ACTION:  Joint Committee members with additional suggestions for topics to discuss with the Commissioner should email them to Maryann Motza.

Joint Committee members were asked to question the managers about their perception of TAP.

Bly asked what percentage of TAP members are meeting the minimally effective level.  Ferree and Nicholas both said about 90 percent.  The participation kind of ebbs and flows and gets better as you go through the year.  Third year members sometimes slow down toward the end of their term.  A warning was made that one mistake most companies make is tending to give more attention to the squeaky wheel instead of the rest and that TAP should not focus all the attention on the non-performers and remember to acknowledge the members who make significant contributions.

Staff does listen to members’ suggestions.  First, the list of frequently asked questions on becoming a member was distributed to all interviewees this year.  Also, it was stressed and stressed about the time commitment.
 
Duquette suggested that as mentioned earlier, when all TAP members leave the next annual meeting in December, they will have signed a contract that acknowledges their responsibilities and agrees to them.  Karwin said so much emphasis is placed on the level of commitment where it should be on what they bring to the process, also what they get out of it.  It’s not all resume building.  It has to do with satisfaction for having an impact on society.  It also needs to be emphasized that making an impact is an extremely slow process and changes might not occur during your tenure.  Duquette added that at least 80 percent are very effective.  J.T. Wright had two points to make

1. When he first started TAP he had great grandiose ideas of what changes he could effect
2. That the effectiveness in recruiting has improved in improving new member’s expectations as well as improving the level of competencies, skills and talents.

Nicholas said staff has talked about the challenges of managing volunteers.  This year TAP has arranged for Rick Lynch, author of Volunteer Management: Mobilizing All the Resources of the Community, to talk to staff about how to manage volunteers. 

Emilio Cecchi asked about the alternate pool.  Coston replied that one problem in pulling in an alternate is without the orientation; they don’t know what they are supposed to do.  Most brought in this way don’t know what to do and don’t become effective members.  It was suggested that retired members be asked to come back to fill the gap.
ACTION:  Coston will find out if retired panel members can be brought back to fill vacancies. 

Duquette said one of the VITA Committee recommendations to the IRS is they donate used computers and laptops to VITA.  Currently, there is a great burden on both the IRS and the volunteer sites to first, distribute the equipment to the volunteer sites and then, collect and completely wipe them at the end of the season.  Under current law, the IRS cannot donate the equipment to the sites since the IRS is restricted to donating only to educational institutions.  There is currently a bill introduced to Congress giving IRS the right to donate the computers to other entities.  Duquette asked for support in having TAP members contact their congressional representatives in supporting this bill.

Karwin reminded the Joint Committee that it had decided that a subcommittee should review the TAB 2 report and provide feedback that showed a high degree of relevance to what TAP is   doing and what taxpayers are asking.  It was decided to form a subcommittee and Karwin offered to lead the subcommittee.   
ACTION:  Karwin will send out an email to ask for other members interested in reviewing the TAB report and supplying the taxpayer’s view back to the IRS.

Fireman volunteered to be on the committee.  Karwin said he does not see a great need for staff support for this committee since it is not a research project. 
ACTION:  Robb will make copies of the TAB 2 report and send it to Karwin, Fireman, and any other subcommittee members.

J.T. Wright thinks the mentoring program has worked very well so far and helped to get new members up and running.  It should be reemphasized with new members and can be a very enjoyable experience.  Meyers asked if there is a written document regarding TAP’s mentoring program; the mentor/mentee should be aware of the key elements.  Coston said part of being successful is how comfortable you feel with the process.  Whitehead said he sent Nicholas information and written documents about mentoring.  Also, Foley noted that Paul Brubaker put together a written document about the mentoring program last year.  He intended this list be given to the new members; it gives direction as to when to go to a mentor; when to go to the staff; and when to go to the chair. Nicholas said the members are giving three to five-hundred hours right now, and mentoring will add to this process; some members are interested and others aren’t.  It is a two-way street between mentor and mentee and should be kept simple and voluntary.
ACTION:  Coston will check with Brubaker and McQuin and Nicholas to see if they have Brubaker’s and Whitehead’s mentoring document.  
ACTION:  Meyers and Coston will take the mentoring information and draft a one page mentoring “how to” document.

Duquette thought there should also be a mentoring program on the issue committees as well as on the areas.  The mentor can bring the new members up to speed on the issues.  Motza pointed out that chairs should also be mentoring the potential chairs and vice chairs.

Duquette said an issue committee is supposed to march to the drumming of a program owner but frequently the program owner does not have as much expertise as some of the members.  TAP members hear about issues in the field and through outreaches.  These are issues the program owners may not be aware of.  Are we supposed to elevate these issues through the program owner or through the Joint Committee?  Coston asked when you were able to discuss these issues with a program owner how were they documented.  Duquette responded that they were documented in the committee annual assessment.  A specific example: the IRS provides volunteers with software, TaxWise.  It crashed and burned several times because it was not tested properly.  TAP members volunteered to try out the software before it was distributed to all tax preparers to see if we could make it crash.  The IRS is not sure the contractor will agree.  Motza said the IRS could build this requirement into the contract and suggested VITA make it a written recommendation. 

Coston noted that if VITA worked behind the scenes, what is stopping the other issue committees from doing the same?  Duquette replied that is the dilemma.  Should these issues be addressed through the issue committee or should they be elevated through the area?  Coston responded that it should go through the area committee.  Meyers said the issue committees work the issues given to them by the program owner so if it is an issue not given to the committee, it should be brought to the area committee. 

Ferree announced that Bob Erickson, Senior Technical Advisor, Tax Forms & Publications, requested that any committees working with forms or publications should work with the Ad Hoc Committee.  Lee said she did not like that idea because she does not want to add another step in a long process.  J.T. Wright reminded everyone that there is a great resource in the Ad Hoc Committee in dealing with forms and publications issues but the area committees are responsible for working the issues. 

Coston has already set up ongoing meetings with Sue Sottile to go over all W&I issues and will be doing the same with Jodie Patterson to discuss Small Business/Self-employed (SBSE) issues.  Since our last meeting, Foley has received quite a few responses on issues awaiting responses.  Sottile has also been on a few conference calls since then.  She talked about the Form 1040 Schedule F, Profit or Loss from Farming, and the W-9, Request for Taxpayer Identification Number and Certification.  Nina Olson, National Taxpayer Advocate, requested a full list of all of the outstanding issues, due Thursday, June 27.  Olson will present them to acting Commissioner, Kevin Brown.  Bly asked after the responses are caught up, who will be the point person for following up with the IRS?  Coston replied that he would continue to be.

Bly presented the following miscellaneous issues:

• The process for nominating chair and vice chair should get started in October and candidates should post a statement giving members information on why they want to be chair or vice-chair.  A dialog needs to be open about candidates two months prior to the annual meeting; however, new members should not be shut out.  There should still be an opportunity to volunteer and campaign at the annual meeting. 
• Effectiveness of TAP--look at every issue elevated to the IRS in the last two and a half years and find out where those issues originated.  What is TAP’s most productive source of successful issues?  Bly would be willing to work this project with some staff assistance.
• Interviewing new members-before his interview for TAP, Bly talked to two existing TAP members.  This should be recommended to potential interviewees.  Solicit current members to see if they would be willing to talk to candidates about their experience before the interviews. 
• Strongly urge JC members to develop an agenda for the Chicago face-to-face meeting.  Each item should have a specific purpose and a statement on what the Committee wants to accomplish.  After that is developed, the length of the meeting can be determined. 

Next meeting is a teleconference on August 1, 2007

Face to face meeting is October 11-13, 2007 in Chicago, IL

• The May 2, 2007 minutes were approved with minor amendments
• The Joint Committee decided the annual report should focus on the accomplishments of TAP and not of the individual committees; it is not a competition.
• Accepted the stated referral process as a trial test for the next area referrals brought to the Joint Committee.
• Communication Strategy subcommittee formed to review the strategy, make suggestions on which strategies and actions should be assigned to the Joint Committee and set suggest priority levels.  The subcommittee is Tom Karwin, lead, MJ Lee, Paul Duquette and Judi Nicholas.
• Reached consensus to elevate Area 1 #4050, Excess Social Security Notice Clarity.
• Reached consensus to elevate #4091, Forms and Publication Information, subject to review by the quality review team.
• Reached consensus to elevate Area 7 #3959, Filing by IRS; the subcommittee will add the California footnotes and send to Foley to elevate.
• Reached consensus to elevate #4037, Private Delivery Services Addresses after Foley adds the form name and makes the other grammatical changes.

• Review the referral process timeline and forward additional suggestions to Meyers within a week.
• Motza will check to see if new postings to the discussion room will cause a new email notification.  In the meantime, Joint Committee members will need to take on the responsibility of checking the discussion page periodically.   
• Anyone with suggested changes to TAPSpace should email MaryAnn Motza NO LATER THAN JULY 10.
• Members who would like to attend the Commissioner Meeting should send an email to Coston, J.T. Wright, and Meyers.
• Members with additional suggestions for topics to discuss with the Commissioner should email them to Maryann Motza.

• Will work together to get the information the subcommittee needs to complete the annual report.  Foley needs three work days to compile the information and will forward needed information to the subcommittee before July 11, 2007.

• The subcommittee was formed to review the strategy, make suggestions on which strategies and actions should be assigned to the Joint Committee and set suggested priority levels. 
• Prepare a report and lead the discussion regarding the strategy during the Joint Committee meeting in Chicago in October.

• Check with Brubaker, McQuin and Nicholas to see if they have Brubaker’s and Whitehead’s mentoring document. 
• With Meyers take the mentoring information and draft a one page mentoring “how to” document.
• Check with the Committee Management Officer (CMO) as to whether the discussion thread on TAPSpace fits in the FACA requirements and if they have to become part of the public record.  
• Find out if retired panel members can be brought back to fill vacancies. 

• Make the minor wording changes to #4050, Excess Social Security Notice Clarity. 
• The discussion of measures/effectiveness of TAP and a discussion of the survey and annual meeting Agenda will be placed on the October Joint Committee meeting agenda. 

• Check with the Joint Committee members not at this meeting with the option of working on the Joint Committee Communication strategy document.  Meyers will check with Ken Wright as he is a returning member.
• Make the suggested additions to the Area 7 #3959, Filing by IRS proposal and resubmit to Foley.
• Lead a subcommittee to review the TAB report and prepare a draft document supplying the taxpayer’s view for review by the Joint Committee.  Fireman volunteered to be on the committee.
• Send out an email to ask for other members interested in reviewing the TAB report and supplying the taxpayer’s view back to the IRS. 

• Revise the Referral process document and send out to all.
• With Coston will take the mentoring information and draft a one page mentoring “how to” document.
• Karwin should check with the Joint Committee members not at this meeting with the option of working on this strategy document.  Meyers will check with Ken Wright as he is a returning member.

• With the Annual Report subcommittee will finalize the 2006 report by July 17, 2007. Check to see if new postings to the discussion room will cause a new email notification.  In the meantime, Joint Committee members will need to take on the responsibility to check the discussion page periodically.  
• Check to see if new postings to the discussion room will cause a new email notification.  In the meantime, Joint Committee members will need to take on the responsibility of going back out and checking the discussion item for updates.  
• Check on whether documents will post to the current meeting folder as well as the calendar.
• Check to find out if multiple files can be downloaded from TAPSpace on in one action or if each has to be downloaded separately.
• Add that documents posted to TAPSpace that don’t have to be updated should be posted in PDF format to facilitate downloading.
• Check whether or not you can choose to search both regular and archived folders? 

• Make copies of the TAB 2 report and send it to Karwin, Fireman, and any other subcommittee members.

Decision and Action Items from Previous Meetings

• TAP will not have a formal policy on setting the frequency of full committee and subcommittee meetings; however, committees need to be flexible and not meet if there are no decisions that need to be made or work to be done.  (10/12-14/2006) 
• When a committee receives information about a problem that IRS needs to be aware of quickly such as an incorrect link on its website, the committee should draft a letter following the format for referrals as closely as possible.  The paragraph will be reviewed by the Joint Committee and submitted, if approved, to the IRS under the TAP Chair’s signature.  (10/12-14/2006)

• Forward information on their success stories to their committee analyst who will forward them to the Communication Committee. (5/2/2007)
• Send ideas on low-cost ways to publicize the TAP vision to Gil Yanuck, a TAP member on the Communication Committee, or to Barbara Toy who will make sure it is forwarded.  (4/4/2007)
• Any one who finds grammatical errors in the Joint Committee pre-read materials such as minutes and referrals should send the suggested corrections to Barbara Toy.  (02/07/2007)

• Review the Communication Strategy, set priorities and develop a work plan to accomplish the strategies during the year.  (March 7, 2007)

• Work on a time line for the Annual Report and will bring it to the full Joint Committee for approval. (4/4/2007)